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Discussion in 'Hats' started by deanglen, Nov 8, 2007.
Excellent choice. That cap looks great on her!
Got a few of the hats in that I've recently binge ordered...
I'll start with the Monsivais - All Sport - 8 dart cap.
I ordered a premade cap in the size of 7 3/8. The cap I received said 7 1/4. Not sure what happened there, but that's what I got. I spoke with Damien about an issue with my other hat (that I'm about to post about) and I'm sure I can work out an exchange or re-size on this one. All-in-all, the cap does fit, albeit it's a little snug. I've pulled on the leather band a little to give a little room. It seems to have worked a little. In terms of the cap. It looks great. I love the 8 dart look. You can flop it a little to the side to amp up the attitude factor. The feel of the donegal tweed is very nice. Very soft for a tweed. The color is blue with white and some yellow specks. It almost comes across as aqua blue in the right light. Overall, I'm happy with the hat, but want to make sure I get sizing sorted out.
The second hat I bought from Monsivais was a custom order. I loved the look of The Dart from the pictures on their website, I had to buy one.
Monsivais - The Dart 2/4 panel cap
So, again I think there is something up how sizes are listed on his site. This one while not as tight as the All Sport doesn't seem to be what I think of as a 7 3/8 hat. He lists it as 58cm - 7 3/8 - 23 5/8". To me, those numbers don't match and the sizing of both hats didn't seem to match as well. Now like I said in the previous post - I contacted Damien and it looks like he's going to make things right. I'm mentioning this stuff for two reasons - 1) It's good for people to know what they might get themselves into. 2) It's good to know that Damien has been responsive with regard to my issue(s) and has provided good customer service thus far. Now I'll show some pics and explain what I like and don't like about the hat.
So I really dig the fabric choice for this hat in terms of the pattern. I like diamond shape and it works well with a panel based cap. The fit is a tiny bit better on this cap vs. the One Sport. Maybe it's because the leather band isn't wide as on the OS. I'm not sure why. However, it is a bit snug. The look is super cool and hip. It has more of a flat cap look vs. 8 panel and doesn't have as much drape that you can play with, but I'm ok with that. Also, I really like the feel of the leather band vs. gros-grain. This is the same on the All Sport.
What I don't like: I think this is more about fabric choice more than anything else. The fabric seems thinner than other wools, so it doesn't hold the shape of how I thought it would. Pictures of the hat on the website looked a little different than how it looks in person. Like I said previously I still like the look overall.
My only other gripe is that the stitching on the back of the band is starting to come loose. Again I'm sure this can be easily fixed by Damien or even a local tailor.
Overall, I'd say one thumb up for the Monsivais... two for when issues get sorted.
I've seen typos on sizing like that on the Monsivais site, and on a cap for sale from Well Dressed Head. I actually emailed Keith about the discrepancy and he told me the actual size of cap in question.
On the cap I ordered from Cordova, I just told him my hat size in inches, 23-3/8" and that's what he's going with (as listed on his invoice).
Personally, I wouldn't be happy with a custom hat or cap that didn't fit like a custom.
You're right, those numbers don't match up at all.
I've seen "unusual" numbers like these on a few professional hatters' websites, and it doesn't inspire confidence. I'd much rather see a statement like, "Send me your head measurements, and if I don't have the hat you want in stock in that size I'll make one. This is how I want you to measure your head; measure it three times, and send me all three measurements. [instructions follow]." Otherwise it can be a bit of a guessing game, and shipping a hat or cap back and forth beyond the initial purchase can get expensive.
If you go to his site and look at size choices they all look wrong to me. The only thing I can think of is he's listing a 58.7cm hat as 58 and not 59 and-so-on-and-so-forth. The "US" size looks right and the inches measurement looks a little off. I'll mention it to him again. It's confusing and could cause more headaches for those who want the perfect fit.
But yeah, for custom stuff the standard should be how many CM or inches is your head.
So here's my next installment on "The Binge"...
Froggy Went Courting - 1920s Baker Boy - Made by Olney
I wanted to try a WIDE baker boy, but in the 1920s style and somewhere on this forum someone pointed out an outfit called Froggy Went Courting based in the UK. They specialize in vintage clothing as well as reproductions. While I was specifically looking to only buy from bespoke makers of fine head-wear, I figured since this one was reproduced for FWC based on a 1920s pattern, it'd fit the bill.
So this one is an interesting one. Upon opening the hat you can tell the worksmanship is of high quality. Olney makes some nice head-wear and that's pretty much why I'd go with something like this. I also like the color and brown birdseye tweed pattern. I think they accidentally sold me a 60cm hat, when I ordered 59cm so the hat can slip down over time. The hat is quite large in the crown. 12" measured across. For some reason the Monsivais hats, even though they have larger crowns seem to just mesh with me right off the bat. It's not that I don't like the hat. It just seems a little clownish. I dunno. Just a first impression. This one will take a bit to jive with. At least, you can flop it to the side a bit.
What I don't like... well the hat has this plastic strip or tension thing right where the button fastener is. I guess it's supposed to keep some separation between the peak and the crown. Either way it seemed to make the hat look weird to me. It just didn't work for me. So I cut it out. I know - blasphemy. There's no going back now. The pics are taken without it. I'm not sure if the original hats from the 10s-30s had these, but it now seems better without it. The other thing that irks me about the hat is the peak doesn't hold its shape. It's some sort of plastic, but doesn't want to retain a nice curve like the Monsivais hats do.
Otherwise, it's a cool cap. Froggy Went Courting has a few other models made by Olney (a 5 dart) and they're at a decent price. I think with shipping to the US the cap came out to around $92.
This is the cut out plastic tension bar...
Not clownish; looks good to me.
I wish you had pics of the cap Before and After removing the part you didn't like...
ok... i have some before pics...
I guess I didn't like the way it made the front sit... YMMV...
So now we're coming back to sort of where it started for me with the bespoke caps. I first found out about the B! Wear caps on here, then shortly found out about another cap maker called the Hat People. Most of you guys I'm sure are already aware of both vendors. In general it seems like people either like hats from one or the other.
The Hat People - Newsboy in Full Cut.
So if I were to compare this to the B! Wear cap, I'd say it's thinner in material; the peak isn't as malleable. The B! Wear has a wire in the peak that allows one to shape it with more ease. It seems the peak on this one has a nice curve that you just wanna leave it the way it is. I like that the peak is bigger though. The draping is about the same. I'd say the B! Wear is a full cut, so it kinda matches the look of this one. I know there is a Rocky version that has a bigger peak and slightly larger crown. That could be interesting The mushrooming effect that some people say is a part of the B! Wear cap seems to be about the same as with this one. But I will say that since this one doesn't have a button/snap, it actually allows you to play with the drape a bit more and that allows one to remove that mushroomy look. I like how on the B! Wear it has a nice and sturdy nubuck or suede band (not sure which one). It makes the hat feel secure, but not too snug. Where as the HP cap feels like it's almost floating on your head. Finally, the worksmanship is a little bit better on the HP cap. It's just in the little details and stitching. It's seems like maybe the B! Wear caps are churned out maybe a little faster so there's some sloppiness going on. Overall, I like both just as much...
The Hat People cap is my favorite, I would purchase one like that. Looks nice. The B hat, not so much.
You've made me decide. I'm going to get one by Hat People.
I have three Hat People caps, all "full cut":
Left to right - White, grey, and black Herringbone; brown, green, and black Herringbone; black and grey Herringbone. Their sizing and the quality of their work are consistent; all three caps fit exactly the same. They're very comfortable and, being made from Pendleton wool (with cotton liners) they keep my head nice and warm on cold nights. I do wish they offered leather sweatbands as an option, and the caps they list on their website are only available while they have the material on-hand (none of these are currently available) so you have to get them while you can, but I really like mine and think they're a heck of a deal for the price.
What do they use in the brim to provide stiffness? Is it the usual plastic insert?
I second Chuck's comments,these are great caps.
It's a plastic insert, but like I said it doesn't hold its shape as much as I'd like. Maybe there's a way with applied heat to get it to hold the desired shape.
I ended up having to apply a thin piece of foam that has adhesive on it to the back of the hat to get it to stay still on my head. 60cm is just a tad too large for my head. I could have mentioned to FWC that they sent me the wrong size cap, but I had already cut the peak insert out. I suppose if the foam insert deteriorates or falls out, I could always go to a tailor to see if they can insert cotton, etc. into the band to "shrink" it down a bit. Anyone have experience with having a hat a tad bit too large?
I ended up getting the black and grey herringbone. I initially bought heather grey, but decided to give Carol a buzz to see what else they had in stock. She mentioned they had enough of the black and grey left from another customer that bailed on their hat before it was finished. If I were going to do another HP hat, I'd go with extra full cut next time.
Nice! The herringbone pattern is fairly subtle, and overall I find mine goes well with most of my wardrobe. That being said, I tend to wear my "brown, green, and black" herringbone more often simply because I like the color(s) so much.
I briefly considered getting one, but I have a Capas flat cap that's cut very similarly to Hat People's extra full cut (or at least that's how it looks to me when I compare it to the "extra full cut" photo on their website) and I think it's a bit too much for me.
I'm wearing my hair quite a bit shorter now than I did when the photos were taken, and sometimes I think even the "full cut" is a bit much. But I realize I'm the only person who thinks that, so I wear my Hat People caps happily.