The ultimative Denim Trouser Thread?

Discussion in 'General Attire & Accoutrements' started by CatsCan, Oct 31, 2020.

  1. Edward

    Edward Bartender

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    My 13mwzs are labelled "made in Mexico from American Denim".

    Some are surprisingly expensive... I looked at eBay a while back with a half-baked notion of picking up a couple of old, used bike helmets for room decor, but it's surprising how pricey some can be. But then Lewis still charge £430 for their Superjet helmet that isn't even road legal! I can't fathom who would spend that on a lid they can't use on the road.... maybe Rocker cosplay is bigger than I thought? Or a lot of cyclists use them?
     
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  2. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    Since there are two parallel theads about the exact same matter I suggest, that we move this thread to the other denim thread. How do you feel about that, Kermit? Folks? Bartenders?
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
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  3. bn1966

    bn1966 Call Me a Cab

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    Good posts Cats Can,

    I gave up on Levi jeans due to inferior quality we were receiving in the UK and the short life span of the garments.

    I went into Freddies and then discovered Pike Brothers who are my go to clothiers nowadays. I buy more products from them than anything else.

    Brexit meant I was unable to make purchases since just before Christmas, now thankfully the situation has been rectified and shopping with Pike has recommenced :) They are doing a great line in black T shirts & vests at the moment..top quality.
     
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  4. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    We have to get some things sorted on both sides of the channel, but when we have, I hope you islanders will come back.
     
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  5. bn1966

    bn1966 Call Me a Cab

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    I’m happily buying from Germany and France again, when this mess is over I’ll be back visiting Europe...no man is an Island :)
     
  6. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    This happens all day and every day in Marlboro Country ( USA ) as well.
     
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  7. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    Well said!
     
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  8. Blackadder

    Blackadder Call Me a Cab

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    AFAIK, Wrangler sold off their overseas operations many years ago to focus on producing work and cowboy rodeo clothing which is why their lineup has not changed for so many years, the same old 13MWZ, 936, 945 etc. They did move production from US to Mexico. Moving to the overseas operations, what Wrangler Europe and Wrangler Japan did are very different. Same as LVC, Wrangler Japan actually has a Wrangler Archive collection reproducing the old 11mw etc with Japanese selvedge denim. Unfortunately though for those living outside Japan, the Wrangler Japan items are not available because of the licencing. It is pretty strict too as the official Edwin shop has cancelled an order I made through a well known proxy service.
    There are still brands in the US that make workwear and their jeans are solid, non-selvedge but tough.
    Cone mills USA has closed but even before its demise, their supply of selvedge denim has been rather limited. Japanese mills have made up for the slack which is why you will see Gap and other American brands using Japanese selvedge denim in their premium collection. These are made in India or Bangladash with Japanese denim. These are quite affordable regular 11-13oz denim.
    For those who like the heavy denim, there is the Unbranded 21oz which uses Japanese selvedge denim. They mentioned that they were made in Macau a few years back. I am not sure where they are made now.
    If on the other hand, you are not into extra heavy denim, there are some Japanese Brands that produce pretty well made raw selvedge jeans at half the price of say Iron Heart. IMO Sugar Cane and Kojima Genes prices are pretty fair but then one has to keep in mind the import duties and your local sales tax.
     
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  9. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    I don't see Samurai and L Artisan mentioned much on these forums. They are both excellent Japanese brands. A little cheaper than IH. Samurai denim reminds me of the vintage Levis 501.
     
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  10. handymike

    handymike I'll Lock Up

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    The only thing I didn’t like so much on the Wranglers is the rubber patch on the back pocket, so I removed it before the initial Hot Water Soak...so far, these jeans are great! I would try the 936, but they cost double...mine are listed as made in Nicaragua.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
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  11. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    Very good and useful detailed info, Blackadder!

    @Sonero, I don't know if I am correct, but I think Samurai's Denims are made at the Collect Mills in Okayama, they also make the Denims for Rampuya, Japan, which in a corporation with Blue Owl Seattle produce the "Japan Blue" Jeans. I have their Monster Selvedge 16,5 oz, I thing the Lot was JB0412. It is a medium heavy but kind of slack weave, feeling very comfortable to wear. The quality in everything from the weave to the stitching, is outstanding, and they claim this to be entry level! The leather label was produced by Tanner Goods in the USA. I love these jeans. But unfortunately, they don't fit me anymore.
    Look at that fantastic weave and stitching! It's details like these that I love seeing on a very good pair of jeans.

    1.JPG 2.JPG 3.JPG 4.JPG 5.JPG 7.JPG 8.JPG 9.JPG 10.JPG

    11.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
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  12. Blackadder

    Blackadder Call Me a Cab

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    There are forums dedicated to denim. You will find all kinds of brands mentioned there including Samurai and SDA.
    Samurai jeans cloth is usually pretty rough and that increases the friction for quicker fading but also ripping apart.
     
  13. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    Perhaps I have confused Samurai with Momotaro in my last post. But I do believe that Collect Mills in Kojima, Okayama, Japan provides the denims for both brands. Here you have the "science" of denim that was mentioned previously. There is a lot to explore. The looms used at Collect were made by Toyoda about 1924. The same company turned to automobile production in 1937 as Toyota. So the denim of the jeans I showed in my previous post was made on these old machines and then put together by skilled female workers who not only are able to make some of the most valuable kimonos you can buy today but also earn very good money. But still, just pants!
     
  14. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    A fine assessment of the Samurai product. I would just like to add that there is definitely a big difference between fabrics depending on the model. I 've got one pair of very slim Samurais that have a rugged pebble feel to the fabric never experienced anywhere before. I can actually double down on that with SASHIKO. Wow what a beautiful fabric. They are known to shrink a lot so just a heads up.
     
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  15. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    Momotaro has the horrible habit of adding 2 white branded rings in white paint to their clothing. It's a horrible look for an otherwise decent product. Why doesn't someone tell the designer ? :)
     
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  16. CatsCan

    CatsCan One of the Regulars

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    Yeah, I never liked that white "battle stripes" design on the rear pocket on their pants, either. I suspect they mainly wanted to attract primarily the japanese customers with the allusion to the Samurais of the Edo period. Their brand name was based on the popular folklore figure Momotaro, however, who, according to the legend, hetched from a peach! This figure is extremely popular in the Okayama district and his legend known by everyone. They should only put it back into the peach when it comes to their jeans. Would that be an" impeachment"? Uhm. Probably not. Too much TV today. But the peach story is responsible for the pink coloured selvedge line. Ok. Pink selvegde line plus bold white stripes across one rear pocket - possibly too much for non-japanese.

    Argh, my JB has it, too. Never realised. Honestly, not really bad at all... Ok, I take back the comment about the selvedge line. Just the white stripes thing remains.

    7.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
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  17. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    A double ring leather patch wouldn't be a bad idea. The way it is now its either you do war paint or you don't !
     
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  18. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    Just a heads up for you Wrangler guys.

    My new 936 came in today. They are made in >>> NICARAGUA. 100% cotton but they look like a pair of counterfeit jeans you would see at a local mercado in Latin America. I've been too several of them. The difference between these and the old made in Mexico are huge. I guess I can add Wranglers as another item not to be purchased online.

    I purchased mine directly from Wrangler USA.

    And they have ELASTIC in the fabric. Not 100% real denim.
     
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  19. Blackadder

    Blackadder Call Me a Cab

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    Same cut, two versions
    100% 14oz cotton
    https://www.wrangler.com/shop/wrang...fit-jean-0936R.html?dwvar_0936R_color=0936DEN
    With spandex
    https://www.wrangler.com/shop/wrang...-jeans-936MAF.html?dwvar_936MAF_color=936AFPW

    Even 70s Wrangler may contain spandex because the trend back then was for skin tight jeans or skin tight flare jeans. Things is spandex is actually tougher than cotton but the heavyweight 100% cotton feels more substantial and secure.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2021
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  20. Sonero

    Sonero Practically Family

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    Interesting. Thanks for this.


    I have been buying this model for maybe 2 years now and out of maybe 5 pairs this is the only one with any stretch to it. It's ok since the fit is great and I need lighter jeans for warm weather BUT the elastic creates a lot of white patches in the denim even at only 1% elastic. The Gap and Levis have the same issues.
     

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