Toppers Unite

Discussion in 'Hats' started by Garrett, Feb 17, 2009.

  1. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    IMG_20171130_155913.jpg here's the logo for you
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2017
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  2. mayserwegener

    mayserwegener

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    14,299
    Location:
    Maryland
    Yes they would be for dressage. I assume you are buying vintage because of lack of Silk Plush. Here is a Pajk Dressage Melusine Top Hat (from an Ebay auction).

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2017
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  3. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    and as for the restoration work I don't have a lot of free time and petitgas is a days drive away so that might first be some months from now
     
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  4. mayserwegener

    mayserwegener

    Messages:
    14,299
    Location:
    Maryland
    Thanks! There isn't any information of Swedish makers here. I specialize in the German and Austrian Hat Industries. My guess is your Top Hat is from the late 19th Century.
     
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  5. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    there is a date on the inside but I can't seem take a proper picture its located behind sweatband with the numbers 10/6/12
     
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  6. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    translated from the logo it says his majesty the king's court supplier
    fabricator logo
     
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  7. mayserwegener

    mayserwegener

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    Location:
    Maryland
    Yes that date (1912) would make sense. I look forward to eventually seeing the restoration work. Does Petigas do the work or do they contract out?
     
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  8. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    for toppers bowlers homburgs flatcaps and papersboys they do it themselves however I can't answer for hats like fedoras or cowboys but I do belive they have a contracts with Stetson Jonathan Richards mayser wegener tesi and another company named borsalino?

    https://www.facebook.com/pages/F-Petitgas-Eftf/430711750322435
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2017
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  9. Ann Sadler

    Ann Sadler New in Town

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    Location:
    Sussex
    What is the crown height on those, they look quite low? Silk looks nicer a lot of us have vintage habits from the 30s or a bit earlier or later and the sheen on the silk and getting the right shape and height just makes all the difference to the overall picture.
    Regards,
    Ann
     
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  10. mayserwegener

    mayserwegener

    Messages:
    14,299
    Location:
    Maryland
    I am not sure on the crown height but my guess is around 4 inches. Sergej Pajk (owner / maker) told me that his business was hurt because dressage riders are now wearing helmets (safety issues). I agree vintage Silk Plush is the way to go for Top Hats. I am focused on vintage / antique German and Austrian Soft and Stiff Felt Hats (very large collection) but I have a number of vintage / antique Silk Top Hats.
     
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  11. Ann Sadler

    Ann Sadler New in Town

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    27
    Location:
    Sussex
    Yes safety issues also restrict us sometimes. I wouldn't risk a silk hat or my head out hunting and most people change into safety helmets after the meet and before setting off. I hope the time doesn't come when we aren't able to wear them at all.
    Regards,
    Ann
     
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  12. steur

    steur I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    9,985
    Location:
    Nederland
    Thanks for uploading this. It's great to see these old and untouched hat-shops still exist. Pity there are no subtitles because my Danish is poor to the point of non-existant.
     
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  13. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    so here is a rough translation of the above video:
    ehh the shop here was founded by Monsieur francois petitgas who was French and came here at the very young age of a 30 years money in eighteen hundred and fifty seven after he had worked as a trainee in the cities various hatters at the time among others one in gothersgade and so decided to open one here the 31st of april 1857 and most of the interior we are looking at is from his time the glass is from back then the cubbards are from back then there are a few modern things in here in the form of the boutiques clock the cash register and the led windows in swamp oak and then the glass ceiling which all comes from the modernization back in the 1890s and the whole property is under legal protection because of the shop and its front it began in 1997 when I decided to begin wearing a hat and back then the only place you could buy a mens hat was here so I went in and began conversing with mr Jensen kurt P. Jensen and found myself a brown felt hat this thing with the hats was kind of a cross between bernards interest for hats but also the fact that he was really nerdy about things and then there were also my part in this because I am a textile designer so you can say in a way everything went into a higher unit in the hatters shop ehmm so I left IVM in December back in 2012 there I became an assistant for mr Jensen so he could be allowed to close that year when you first arrive and open the door if you are unprepared you will go what is this
    that experience you only get once if you've seen pictures of it beforehand then you'll already be prepared for what is to come so its a lot of fun when those that just come in and stare or go I'm not here to buy anything I just wanted to have a look or I came here with my grandfather it is so joyful to watch an elderly lady stand with her grandchild in hand and tell she came here with her grandpa and now little baby chicken have to see the same its just fantastic 59kroner yes how does that feel well the size works good but when you say it like that then theres something else off right? well it is kinda when I get the thing on what do you think it was that it was that you just have to take a look now I'm just gonna come and test sizehere yeah that seems to be the right size and that is a 58 that is indeed a 58 but we could try a 59 have me adjust it a little so it becomes a 58.5 I think there's a finished movement in it and then when a customer stands in here and says wow that is exspensive and we try to correct to I can accept that you say its a lot of money but what you don't know is how many man hours goes into producing this thing yes it takes 7 weeks to make one of those but the thing is when you have seen someone make it then the price actually becomes rather cheap this here is the classic broad brim borsalino and we can just determen that they are very good with colours yes the colours are superb they know there colours so long as this is a hat then it will come from borsalinos rather hideous factory down in north Italy which is gonna make you say this place couldn't possible produce anything beautiful well they can and in there they have giant boxes on wheels which contains this light under fur of bunnies which is this fluff it doesn't even look like threads its finner than that it is equivelant to several kubic meters of dust bunnies and that is then processed by a serius of very old machines and some of them they'll proudly state that they have invented those themselves and you can only answer we never would have guessed they can be as long as a HT section bus and with the help of air and rather suptle movement which then allows the machinery to sort out all the lightest and finest hairs those that fly the longest inside this apparatus and it is a very long machine and over at the end there is a waterfall of the finest hairs it looks like they stick together but you touch them they fall apart and that will then be sent over to the next machine in the line which then uses a very large cone shaped vacuum inside a steel container to blow all of these fine hairs into a chamber it looks almost like a huge phonebooth and this cone is in the middle and it takes and sucks its filled with holes in a lot of hair and then blows all this fine stuff out using a bunch of small holes and the small stuff just lies down in a sheet over this cone and then a small amount of water on it and then you can just pull it off and begin felting and then one after another gets felted using water and heat and soap and hand power and hand power and power well yes they stand and with there short sleeves the sweat pours and rubber gloves it gets done they have there own colouring and there own reference cards like its so extreme everything happens there they just know fine and easy they can do it with it still being strong it is just raw delicious it is a long process all the way down to the sanding machines which are used to sand the hats to make sure that the hairs lay the same way in there direction to have them stretched in the right shape that just is impressive and when one has seen that it no longer becomes an exspensive hat it might be a lot of money just 3000 kroner (479dollar roughly ) there have gone so many man hours into it well then that was easy well its not like there are twenty two models that look somewhat like that one right right I think that is actually a good found when you put it like that is that jutlandish excitement? well this one is a bit wide don't you think well it is a bit wide so I shall properbly orient you about the shape of it its actually too small for you yeah it sits abit tide we should propebly move up a size yeah that's true thanks for the help I think ill head home now you too the panama hat came into being thanks to the construction of the panama canal because the works down there needed a light hat so panama hat actually comes from Ecuador and it is in fact not made from straw but from palm tree fibres which get cut in a very fine manner and is also dried cooked and the process is very long and some of what you pay for is how well it has been put together and I usually say everyone can fold a Christmas heart with two or three binds but what if it now was 336 then it requires needle and looper and pencet and lots of patience because you can always make hats of other fibres in this case hemp fibres and now I have to say all the other stuff has been taken out so there are only the fibres left but that gives you in exchange a very soft and flexible hat not that your to go around and crush but you can do it because now we have borsalino ones again they are very good with colours so something like this is becomes extremely sharp pretty little hat which is also soft not that it should be twisted or in any other way curled op but you can very quickly make three different hat styles just by altering the brim now we end up asking what sort person you'll want to appear like should I be sharp evening or the more welcoming maybe this soft way it is a super hat when borsalino puts itself to something then they are then they are second to none we'll explain to the customers that they are the worlds best hatters and that is a nice thing to be able to say with a stiff back and look theres a borsalino ones again they make it without artificial stuff like silicone 'enhancements' no nothing this is the last stop before no hat and it weighs what does it weight? nothing! the wildest are those made from master weavers and last time I checked there was only 12 of them left in the world and a master weaver can according to legend make 5 hats a year I haven't seen it myself so a years work is 5 hats and hats like that are sold long before they are even finished because people order them beforehand and I think the last price was and ill just quickly mention it hasn't been verified but it is somewhere around a hundred and twenty thousand dkk (19173.60 USD) the most important thing is for the hat to fit right a thing I like to do when it is really windy is to put my finger below the brim because then I get an early warning if the winds catch it but if they are really good like this borsalino here its a beaver felt and it has a storm line mounted on it so you can take it and attach it to a button or your jacket it can still blow off but it can not blow away and then there is this one with a little more edge and a little more wave then you can just tip it a little over and its actually not a lot that is needed right? its just a small amount in contrast to a complete side turn then you've should have stopped an hour ago this guy is 'tired' right? he needs to be helped home now and it is it is like you know that one we've sometimes talked about with the shirt buttons one is relaxed two is really relaxed three is infatuated with thyself and four five and beyond is a drunkard that should have gone home along time ago so small detailes can be everything that makes the diffirence between elegant and have a safe journey home

    PS:i am very sorry for the massive wall of text but here it is for anyone curius about what they are talking about but is unable to speak Danish or may just be rusty
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
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  14. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    there are a total of five maybe seven hatters in Denmark petitgas being the oldest of them others include
    Kirsten hatterkunst PeterBangsVej 105 in Frederiksberg note the video below is also in Danish without subtitles which I may or may not translate at a latter point in time but don't expect anything


    hornskov on Strandgade 10 in Copenhagen some of his stuff is in English some in Danish some with subtitles some without also note that the hatter? below Is currently being sued by nick faquet over matches behind the bands
    he is also the hatter in Denmark with the largest internet presence of the lot probably


    the above video just talks about how he thought there was a lack of hatters and therefor decided to become one


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XtNq2uTsV4
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEBdqcBWF-Y
    https://www.hornskovkobenhavn.com/
    https://www.facebook.com/hornskovkobenhavn/
    https://www.instagram.com/hornskovhats/

    this one doesn't have a site and the one below's site can barely be spoken of
    Andersen&berner hatte on Nørrebrogade 45A copenhagen
    Susanne juul on Store Kongensgade 14 Copenhagen
    well there is vostrup hattemager but I don't know if they still exist though also also still in Danish half an hour long not gonna translate that anytime soon sorry also I don't think people would like to have an even larger wall of text in here
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJUw50ZRCGs
    there is also marie wahlstrøm on toldbodgade in Aarhus which I think closed down a few years ago or something
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
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  15. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
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  16. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    well all hats starts like this and out of this peace of felt this hat is the biggest hat you can get then it stiffens so it interes the felt and then it will have to dry so this I can show just now to dry it so you always turn the inside out so if there is something it gets into the hat and then all we to do is use the bucket which contaisn shellack on water and then all it has to do is go down there and suck it in so all the lacker inters the felt now it goes trough this one and so the excess water leaces now it just need moisture so you can stretch the felt and then it will have to be put in a plastic bag and then afterwards be placed Into the steam for a little while so you can stretch the felt and now that we have heated the shaper so it dries a little faster and then it becomes completely soft when it leaves and then you can just stretch it and then we you these threads to keep it in place it is also what helps give the felt its shape when it stiffens on the shape and then it enters for the last time were it then cooks all the way through the felt so it becomes really tight I can make sixty hats a day with this method then it just dryes in the heating room and then it gets sewn decorated using this sewing machine theres a hat for everybody its just about finding it for example people with glasses shall chose something that rounds a person with glasses should never chose a hat like this it just doesn't look good on people with glasses they need stuff that rounds and for example broad brimmed hats are good for tall people whereas small people should go for a smaller brimmed hats like this where there isn't a lot of shade and there is a lot of small people they want to wear big hats but that just ends op looking comical and then decide hats just doesn't suit me and it doesn't because it just looks ridiculous but if it all fits then it'll look just fine and then I have this little one and this big one and there can at times be people who think it looks weird but I don't really care about it and that's because I'm I'm I'm not scared of wearing a hat because if you're scared you'll begin worrying about what others think of you which is mostly the reason people wouldn't dare wear a hat
     
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  17. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

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    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
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  18. Ann Sadler

    Ann Sadler New in Town

    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Sussex
    Hi all,
    Any tips for getting a dent out of a silk top hat?
    Regards,
    Ann
     
  19. deeoeraclea

    deeoeraclea New in Town

    Messages:
    35
    the hard calico can be reblocked however I won't advise during something like that yourself as it is a difficult partaking and may damage your hat I'd advise asking a hatter like patey or lock&co they might be able to give you further advise if you don't want to spend money on having them reblock it for you
     
  20. Ann Sadler

    Ann Sadler New in Town

    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Sussex
    Thanks, I have a couple of larger size hats with dents although the silk is perfect. They'll be worth getting done professionally I think.
    Regards,
    Ann
     

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