Questions About the United States Navy Peacoat

[Peacoat]

I'm estimating this peacoat to be 1943 based on @Peacoat's guide to Dating the U.S. Navy Peacoat. I'll defer to Peacoat and others on whether I’m correct. I’m in love with all but one of the WWII peacoat characteristics, including 8 buttons showing, throat latch, corduroy pocket lining, Kersey wool. I’m not fond of the unruly lapel, but that is certainly not a deal breaker.

The reason you are dealing with an unruly lapel is because these coats were not designed to be worn the way you are wearing it. They were designed to be worn with the top button at the throat closed. Navy regulations required the coat to be buttoned all the way to the throat. Sailors hated wearing it this way, and revolted, leaving the top button unbuttoned with the resulting unruly lapel.

The Navy disliking unruly uniforms, gave in to the sailors and redesigned the coat, leading to the post WWII model with he large lapels that we have today.

 

[VansonRider]

You could use a nice bit of marlin spike decorative cordage to hold the top together, but still have some breathing room. It looks awesome and it’s period correct for the coat.

 

[Preppy Climber]

The reason you are dealing with an unruly lapel is because these coats were not designed to be worn the way you are wearing it. They were designed to be worn with the top button at the throat closed. Navy regulations required the coat to be buttoned all the way to the throat. Sailors hated wearing it this way, and revolted, leaving the top button unbuttoned with the resulting unruly lapel.

The Navy disliking unruly uniforms, gave in to the sailors and redesigned the coat, leading to the post WWII model with he large lapels that we have today.

Thank you!

 

[Preppy Climber]

You could use a nice bit of marlin spike decorative cordage to hold the top together, but still have some breathing room. It looks awesome and it’s period correct for the coat. View attachment 601091 View attachment 601092

Great idea, @VansonRider! Never thought about this as an option. Yes on the breathing room. Thank you so much for sharing!

 

[VansonRider]

My ‘49/50ish pea coat arrived and it is in barely worn condition… no wear on the sleeve edges, the pocket edges, on the collar… nothing.
No moth nips.
The corduroy pockets have no wear, and no… like… sand? Grit? I love old wool surplus gear and it almost always has some bits of dirt in the pockets but this has nothing like that.
And the wool feels really firm, not hard, but it has a ton more body than any of my later dated other coats.
The liner is in pristine condition and get this.
The hang ribbon at the neck is still attached!
that’s the first time I’ve ever seen an unbroken hang loop, even in pictures!

And with the build date it’s cut a lot closer than the late 60s models, too.

It fits like a sport coat. I could wear it over a shirt and tie and that’s maybe it. Not really any layering room which is perfect because the 46r from 1970 has all the room I could use.

I think in an ideal world I’d wear a 1949 in a 46 or a 1968 in a 44, that would leave sweater room but not be baggy at all…

But I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo! They’re the beeist of kneeses. Anyone looking for a 40r? LOL

 

[VansonRider]

The reason you are dealing with an unruly lapel is because these coats were not designed to be worn the way you are wearing it. They were designed to be worn with the top button at the throat closed. Navy regulations required the coat to be buttoned all the way to the throat. Sailors hated wearing it this way, and revolted, leaving the top button unbuttoned with the resulting unruly lapel.

The Navy disliking unruly uniforms, gave in to the sailors and redesigned the coat, leading to the post WWII model with he large lapels that we have today.

Hey Peacoat!
I couldn't figure out how to tag a member so I'm hoping a reply will serve the same purpose!

My new to me '49 coat has some loose buttons. I'm going to resew them using the RobertJeffrey.us coat button guide and I'll be putting "stay buttons" behind them to make this coat as bomb proof as I can.
Is there a specific coat button thread that's kind to vintage wool or historically used for these coats?
Have you used backing buttons, or have a recomendation? (If you're unfamiliar it’s essentially just a small smooth button on the inside of the coat, you sew the coat’s buttons through the fabric and the backing button, so the coat thread can’t pull through the fabric)
I’m sure I’m being overly picky, but I MUST be in good company here!

Oh! And has anyone had button holes added to a post ‘68 coat, so you can button it right over left as well as left over right, like the older versions? I really like that feature and I don’t see it being a problem to just have a pro add button holes, but I’d want it to be in exactly the right place and to be done just like the existing holes. Any thoughts?

Thank you!

 

[Preppy Climber]

My ‘49/50ish pea coat arrived and it is in barely worn condition… no wear on the sleeve edges, the pocket edges, on the collar… nothing.
No moth nips.
The corduroy pockets have no wear, and no… like… sand? Grit? I love old wool surplus gear and it almost always has some bits of dirt in the pockets but this has nothing like that.
And the wool feels really firm, not hard, but it has a ton more body than any of my later dated other coats.
The liner is in pristine condition and get this.
The hang ribbon at the neck is still attached!
that’s the first time I’ve ever seen an unbroken hang loop, even in pictures!

And with the build date it’s cut a lot closer than the late 60s models, too.

It fits like a sport coat. I could wear it over a shirt and tie and that’s maybe it. Not really any layering room which is perfect because the 46r from 1970 has all the room I could use.

I think in an ideal world I’d wear a 1949 in a 46 or a 1968 in a 44, that would leave sweater room but not be baggy at all…

But I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo! They’re the beeist of kneeses. Anyone looking for a 40r? LOL

Sounds like a wonderful, hardly used peacoat, @VansonRider! And I agree on two size peacoats! My size 32 is still in the freezer to kill of potential larvae. Can't wait to bust that one out!

 

[spoonbelly1950]

My ‘49/50ish pea coat arrived and it is in barely worn condition… no wear on the sleeve edges, the pocket edges, on the collar… nothing.
No moth nips.
The corduroy pockets have no wear, and no… like… sand? Grit? I love old wool surplus gear and it almost always has some bits of dirt in the pockets but this has nothing like that.ape!!!!
And the wool feels really firm, not hard, but it has a ton more body than any of my later dated other coats.
The liner is in pristine condition and get this.
The hang ribbon at the neck is still attached!
that’s the first time I’ve ever seen an unbroken hang loop, even in pictures!

And with the build date it’s cut a lot closer than the late 60s models, too.

It fits like a sport coat. I could wear it over a shirt and tie and that’s maybe it. Not really any layering room which is perfect because the 46r from 1970 has all the room I could use.

I think in an ideal world I’d wear a 1949 in a 46 or a 1968 in a 44, that would leave sweater room but not be baggy at all…

But I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo! They’re the beeist of kneeses. Anyone looking for a 40r? LOL

WOW, A '49 in that great of shape!!!! And in that size is one hell of a find!!!! Enjoy and good luck.

 

[VansonRider]

I’ve just tried a bunch of ways to get some pictures, mirror selfy, timer photos, different parts of my apartment, different lighting, and it always looks like a big black coat
I think it’s the New York Aprt walls painted in gloss eggshell white, it just washes all the coat details away every time!
How do I take a picture of how the wool feels?!?

 

[Peacoat]

Hey Peacoat!
I couldn't figure out how to tag a member so I'm hoping a reply will serve the same purpose!

My new to me '49 coat has some loose buttons. I'm going to resew them using the RobertJeffrey.us coat button guide and I'll be putting "stay buttons" behind them to make this coat as bomb proof as I can.
Is there a specific coat button thread that's kind to vintage wool or historically used for these coats?
Have you used backing buttons, or have a recomendation? (If you're unfamiliar it’s essentially just a small smooth button on the inside of the coat, you sew the coat’s buttons through the fabric and the backing button, so the coat thread can’t pull through the fabric)
I’m sure I’m being overly picky, but I MUST be in good company here!

Oh! And has anyone had button holes added to a post ‘68 coat, so you can button it right over left as well as left over right, like the older versions? I really like that feature and I don’t see it being a problem to just have a pro add button holes, but I’d want it to be in exactly the right place and to be done just like the existing holes. Any thoughts?

Thank you!

Yes, I use backing buttons. I think the thread I use is a nylon thread. It is hardier than the cotton thread.

 

[VansonRider]

Thank you Peacoat! Nylon and backing buttons it is

 

[Preppy Climber]

Me and my WWII US Navy peacoat, size 32. Fits perfect with an oxford cloth button down (which I'm wearing in these photos) or a t-shirt. @Peacoat said the size 32 would be a great fit for me and he was right--as always! I will of course keep my WWII size 34 to wear with layers.

As @VansonRider said, "...I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo!"

 

[Peacoat]

That is an excellent fit. The size 32 is hard to find . You did well.

 

[Preppy Climber]

That is an excellent fit. The size 32 is hard to find . You did well.

Thank you, Peacoat!

 

[spoonbelly1950]

Me and my WWII US Navy peacoat, size 32. Fits perfect with an oxford cloth button down (which I'm wearing in these photos) or a t-shirt. @Peacoat said the size 32 would be a great fit for me and he was right--as always! I will of course keep my WWII size 34 to wear with layers.

Me and my WWII US Navy peacoat, size 32. Fits perfect with an oxford cloth button down (which I'm wearing in these photos) or a t-shirt. @Peacoat said the size 32 would be a great fit for me and he was right--as always! I will of course keep my WWII size 34 to wear with layers.

As @VansonRider said, "...I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo!"

View attachment 604921
View attachment 604922

Beautiful coat. Looks brand new.
As @VansonRider said, "...I’m sticking with my one snug and one roomy combo!"

View attachment 604921
View attachment 604922

Beautiful coat. Looks brand new. Good luck with it.

 

[Preppy Climber]

Beautiful coat. Looks brand new. Good luck with it.

Thank you!!

 

[Doctor Damage]

Here's a useful guide to sewing on buttons with "backer" buttons to make them more secure. The host uses what appears to a be a genuine USN peacoat as the test subject. She says she sews the threads in an X pattern; for what it's worth, on my Burberry and similar outerwear the buttons are sewn on with a = pattern. Someone can opine on which is more authentic for peacoats. Anyways, a very useful video.

 

[Peacoat]

Good video. She makes the point to use button thread rather than regular thread, and she shows the correct way to make a shank.

I have added this video to the Important Links thread at the top of the Outerwear Section.

 

[vintagewool]

Does anyone know any details about the USN transition away from the kersey-wool pea coat?

I recently saw a pea coat out in public. There was a man inside it so I questioned him:

-He said it was his father's from USN service in the early 1980s.
-He opened the coat and said there was no quilted lining.
-It looked to me like it had no quilted lining and had only something like a half-length lining of that thin kind of sheet to slip easily.
-It looked black to me (in indoor lighting).
-I did not get any information on the type of wool or weight of wool.

Can anyone explain this combination?

Let me know if I should have posted in a different thread.

Thank you.

PS: I am patiently looking for a good deal on a vintage kersey-wool pea coat, not necessarily USN, the COAT's outside pit-to-pit chest measurement of about 44-46" pending further research about fit, in case anyone is looking to lighten their collection.

 

[Peacoat]

I didn't say the post 1979 coats had a quilted lining. I said they had an insulated lining. This is between the outer shell and the inner lining. It can be felt but not seen.

The Navy and Sterlingwear both say the post 1979 coats are dark blue. They aren't; they are black. with a Melton shell.

So, the post 1979 peacoat you saw in the wild had a black Melton shell with an insulated liner to give it warmth. The Kersey coats didn't need this additional liner. They were plenty warm without.

Good catch.