Vintage Saxophones

[Chas]

I know, there's already a thread for instruments.

But saxes are special. Latest acquisition; a 1947 Buescher Aristocrat Alto, silver plated. Very "Johnny Hodges" in it's tone; dark and sexy.

 

[Foofoogal]

That is very nice. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

 

[Silver Dollar]

Way cool. I don't get to see too many of those in my neck of the woods. You can't beat the sounds of good vintage instruments.

 

[Fletch]

Saxes are special. Not in the way guitars are, with all their wood and hand detailing, but because they are the most complicated of all the un-electronic instruments (all right, except maybe the pipe organ). They are technology in your face, plus elegance. I think you have to play them to appreciate them, so they're an acquired taste in a way even guitars are not.

Visit the Sax on the Web Forum at http://forum.saxontheweb.net , and the Saxophone Picture Gallery at http://www.saxpics.com , and learn more than anyone should be allowed to know about these fascinating instruments.

Two of my pets - 1930 Martin Master ("Typewriter") soprano; 1932 Buescher New Aristocrat tenor.

 

[Bebop]

That is a nice alto, Chas. I've always liked the Aristocrats. What shape was it in when you got it? It looks pretty good.

My main alto for the past 20 years has been a Selmer Balanced Action and I have searched high and low to find anything that can come close to how it sounds and feels. Vintage horns are special indeed. :eusa_clap

 

[Silver Dollar]

There was a time way back when where I wanted badly to play the baritone sax. It wasn't Gerry Mulligan who I liked to listen to, it was Serge Chaloff. Mulligan was good but was a bit too intense for me. Chaloff had a beautiful tone and played like it was effortless.

Fletch, I don't really understand what you mean when you say that saxes are an acquired taste in a way even guitars are not. Are you speaking of guitars in general or a specific type of guitar?

IMO, the most complicated guitars made today are the archtops or the "F" hole guitars. They are carved in many different ways and are made of different types of wood to produce different qualities of sound depending on what the player wants. Each part of the archtop must be coordinated with all the other parts or the intended sound cannot be coaxed out of the instrument.

 

[Chas]

sorry; double post. Why the frig doesn't the youtube html code work for me anymore?

 

[Chas]

For the Bari I dig Mulligan and Harry Carney.

While dropping in on my former instructor/tech I saw that one of his coworkers was putting the finishing touches on a Bari; it was a '32 Conn, silver plated - and when he finished it I heard it; incredible, really. It had a warm, full tone unlike any other Bari I have yet heard.

Steve in Everett, Wa. is my man for the vintage horn- his site is pure sax lust.

 

[Fletch]

Fletch, I don't really understand what you mean when you say that saxes are an acquired taste in a way even guitars are not. Are you speaking of guitars in general or a specific type of guitar?

In general, really. The guitar just has a simpler, opener nature - there are different colors and shapes and materials, and the player is open to the audience - they can see hi/r finger movements, and the face and body can be more expressive.

A sax is metal in just a few colors (or else it looks pretty damn silly), and each size is pretty much the same shape. It is something the player kind of closes around and stays behind. Your face is busy working, and your fingers can't be seen so easily with all the busy-ness of the keys.

 

[Silver Dollar]

Thanks for such a quick response Fletch. What's a matta? You never seen a purple and green plaid sax before? Just kidding. I tend to agree with you about a lot of things you've mentioned about guitars in general. I hope I don't step on any guitarist toes here and I hope I don't come off as being snobbish about guitars. shakeshead I don't want to shoot myself in the foot.

I think because of several factors, the role of the guitar in music has been a bit one sided. If a kid plays a violin or a clarinet, it takes him/her a good while to get the correct sound out of it. You tend to want to belt him because he sounds like he's swinging a cat by the tail. The same thing with the sax. However, with a good deal of practice, dedication and hard work, the kid learns to coax that right sound built into that instrument. It's not easy to develop that and "it takes too much work" for many

With many guitars, particularly the solid body electrics, it plays great right out of the box. A lot depends on the electrics on the instrument and the amp to make the kid sound great right off the bat. Plus, especially with some of the "quick results" teaching methods that are out, the student learns some chords and he can literally go out and play with a band. In a year, he's an expert and now "teaches" the thing to his buddies. Then there's the "opposite sex attraction" factor which I don't think I need to elaborate on.

When it comes to the jazz archtop, specifically with the high quality ones and also with classical guitars and the best of the flattops, there's a huge difference. There are many fantastic archtops out there that are very well carved and built to sound incredible. D'Angelico and Stromberg are two of those (along with others). BUT in order to get the instrument's signature sound, a builder needs a lot of training, practice, a well trained ear and hard, precision work to build that great sound in and it takes the player years and a lot of practice to coax it out. The materials are restricted to a few and a lot of the sparkly stuff and color is not a factor. Personally, I play a 1939 D'Angelico Excel archtop. When I bought it 6 years ago, I was told it was one of the best made, in D'Angelico's "golden era". When I played it I sounded like crap but the guy who I bought it from, George Gruhn, is a world class expert on these things. Now in 2010, after playing it exclusively and practicing every day, I'm just now getting that beautiful sound out of the guitar. I now know what every expert is talking about. Even the listeners can tell the difference. With this kind of instrument, you embrace it like you would a great sax, sitting behind it, feeling it's vibration. You sink into your own little space until you stop and put it down.

Now this little rant of mine is not to convince anyone that the guitar is more speicial than any other instrument. I just want to bring the guitar to its rightful legitimate place. I recently joined a synagogue choir where the musical director is just short of a Ph.D. in musicology. When I mentioned a guitar with a pickup, I got a pretty cold welcome. After I played a while, she realized that the guitar was a legitimate instrument, not a toy, a kid's instrument, a folk instrument or a loud, obnoxious sounding intrusion. Here's My guitar's picture:

Here's how you hold one of these things.

 

[vitanola]

I know, there's already a thread for instruments.

But saxes are special. Latest acquisition; a 1947 Buescher Aristocrat Alto, silver plated. Very "Johnny Hodges" in it's tone; dark and sexy.

Stunning instrument!:eusa_clap




Somehow I picture you playing a King or a White C-Melody, though.


a la Wiedoft or Krueger:

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Willikers!

That was too square even for me!

 

[BoPeep]

Thanks for the links, Fletch. I have a Buescher myself. Picked it up in a pawnshop and played it all through school. She's a bit rusty and dusty at the moment from years of non-use, but I could never bring myself to get rid of it. I have no idea it's year or history, but the reason I chose sax (when all the other 11 yr old girls picked flute or clarinet) was simply for its sex appeal. lol

 

[BoPeep]

Woo-hoo!! It's a 1937!

So where does Buescher rank in quality? Are we talking Cadillac or Edsel?

 

[Bebop]

,,,,,,,,, the reason I chose sax (when all the other 11 yr old girls picked flute or clarinet) was simply for its sex appeal. lol

As a boy, I can say that is the reason I switched from clarinet to sax when I was a teenager.

Bueschers made in and around 1937 are pretty good. The newer ones are more "Edselish".

 

[Silver Dollar]

Hey BoPeep, if I were you, I'd never get rid of that sax. With a new set of pads, a little tweaking by a tech and some polish (if you can do that with a sax) and you have a way cool piece of music history. My daughter played the flute and so did half of the girls in her school. Too cliche.

 

[vitanola]

Speaking of saxophones, a really fine-looking top-of-the-line Buescher C-Melody sax has just been listed on the 'Bay, complete with the correct "-C-" Buescher mouthpiece. The C mouthpiece is a bot more restrictive that the modern tenor unit, and when used on a C Melody or a Tenor produces a somewhat softer but much purer tone. Correct intonation is also easier with this design mouthpiece

eBay item number 150489274424.

 

[Chas]

I bought a mouthpiece on ebay once, and wouldn't recommend it. You really need to hear what the thing sounds like on you and your horn to really discern whether or not it works for you.

It's very much an individual thing; I find that some mouthpieces are as different as individual horns are.

 

[Chas]

Thanks for the links, Fletch. I have a Buescher myself. Picked it up in a pawnshop and played it all through school. She's a bit rusty and dusty at the moment from years of non-use, but I could never bring myself to get rid of it. I have no idea it's year or history, but the reason I chose sax (when all the other 11 yr old girls picked flute or clarinet) was simply for its sex appeal. lol

Then pick her up again and play it. There are not enough women playing sax, just like there's not enough men trying to be jazz singers.

 

[Chas]

Speaking of Cadillacs... Conn 30M.

 

[BoPeep]

Then pick her up again and play it.

Just bringing her out to photograph for this thread gave me goosebumps . . like cradling a baby. She needs new pads, cork and a few springs. Also a bit of corrosion on the bottom of the bell. I'm on the hunt for a reputable shop. Or is this something I could do myself?

That Conn is gorgeous, Chas. While I was playing, I toyed with tenors and a baritone (picture 5-foot-nothing me with a bari!). Nothing beats those low tones.