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A cheaper alternative to these leather pants?

Lorinz

Familiar Face
Messages
52
I saw this really nice pair of leather pants at MONFRÈRE for about $1,200:
2023BRANDO22.jpg
greyson-noir-leather-monfrere-2_ef70af33-a76a-47d8-9d1e-b38df4b3a225.jpg
greyson-noir-leather-monfrere-4_736c338d-18e3-406b-b9ac-76a61980aa93.jpg
greyson-noir-leather-monfrere-3_d220be72-c8eb-41cc-a554-a500b189dfac.jpg


I was curious, does anyone know anywhere else that has leather pants in that same kind of style, preferably at a lower price? I've seen some people saying anything much less than a grand for leather pants in that style is gonna be faux leather or generally look very cheap sadly, is that pretty much the case?
 
Messages
16,351
I've seen some people saying anything much less than a grand for leather pants in that style is gonna be faux leather or generally look very cheap sadly, is that pretty much the case?

No, that's some major bs.

The leather pants you've posted, MONFRÈRE, are just your standard five pocket jeans, only made out of lambskin and you don't want pants made out of lambskin and you certainly don't want to pay $1200 for a pair of pants made out of lambskin.

Most high fashion brands make these - Celine, SLP, Dior, Prada, Chanel, you name it - in the exact same cut and style and they all suck. They're just jeans, made from the worst possible choice of leather for a pair of pants you can think of. Plus they all look incredibly cheap, like the ones you posted.

The reason they use lambskin is to achieve the effect @Marc mndt mentioned; It feels, looks and stretches like latex.

Every motorcycle leather jeans look like this, are made from indestructible cowhide and cost from $100 to $400 tops, if you want to go with a quality brand like Vanson or such.

My advice, buy a pair by Schott or Vanson and have the legs tailored. It's what I do. All proper motorcycle 5 pocket jeans are sewn with this in mind, actually.

You don't want to pay $1200 for a shitty pair of pants in any case.
 

AeroFan_07

I'll Lock Up
Messages
5,296
Location
Iowa
No, that's some major bs.

The leather pants you've posted, MONFRÈRE, are just your standard five pocket jeans, only made out of lambskin and you don't want pants made out of lambskin and you certainly don't want to pay $1200 for a pair of pants made out of lambskin.

Most high fashion brands make these - Celine, SLP, Dior, Prada, Chanel, you name it - in the exact same cut and style and they all suck. They're just jeans, made from the worst possible choice of leather for a pair of pants you can think of. Plus they all look incredibly cheap, like the ones you posted.

The reason they use lambskin is to achieve the effect @Marc mndt mentioned; It feels, looks and stretches like latex.

Every motorcycle leather jeans look like this, are made from indestructible cowhide and cost from $100 to $400 tops, if you want to go with a quality brand like Vanson or such.

My advice, buy a pair by Schott or Vanson and have the legs tailored. It's what I do. All proper motorcycle 5 pocket jeans are sewn with this in mind, actually.

You don't want to pay $1200 for a shitty pair of pants in any case.
Monitor is our resident expert in this area. I believe a few others have a couple pair, I have found a good balance in the past with the Red Clouds Collective waxed cotton double knee pants.

That said, I think one reason the OP is drawn to this specific pair of pants is that they are very minimalist in style, slim fitting (too slim for me). That may be harder to achieve with a more traditional cowhide pair of motorcycle jeans.
 

Lorinz

Familiar Face
Messages
52
No, that's some major bs.

The leather pants you've posted, MONFRÈRE, are just your standard five pocket jeans, only made out of lambskin and you don't want pants made out of lambskin and you certainly don't want to pay $1200 for a pair of pants made out of lambskin.

Most high fashion brands make these - Celine, SLP, Dior, Prada, Chanel, you name it - in the exact same cut and style and they all suck. They're just jeans, made from the worst possible choice of leather for a pair of pants you can think of. Plus they all look incredibly cheap, like the ones you posted.

The reason they use lambskin is to achieve the effect @Marc mndt mentioned; It feels, looks and stretches like latex.

Every motorcycle leather jeans look like this, are made from indestructible cowhide and cost from $100 to $400 tops, if you want to go with a quality brand like Vanson or such.

My advice, buy a pair by Schott or Vanson and have the legs tailored. It's what I do. All proper motorcycle 5 pocket jeans are sewn with this in mind, actually.

You don't want to pay $1200 for a shitty pair of pants in any case.

Thanks for the response. I'm curious, what makes lambskin the worst choice of leather for pants? I know lambskin is a very soft and delicate leather, do they damage or rip more easily? Like even moreso than normal plain denim jeans?
 
Messages
16,351
Thanks for the response. I'm curious, what makes lambskin the worst choice of leather for pants? I know lambskin is a very soft and delicate leather, do they damage or rip more easily? Like even moreso than normal plain denim jeans?

While this depends entirely on your lifestyle of course - In example, on the nature and the extent of wear you will subject your pants to - I do believe you'd regardless want your very expensive pair of leather pants to be as durable as possible since repairs aren't really an option. So yep, lambskin is simply too delicate for a pair of pants. It rips extremely easily, sometimes even from no external factors. Even the thinnest cotton fabric is incomparably tougher than lamb.

It also barely even looks like leather per se. I still more often than not, can't tell it apart from some synthetic faux leather material.

And aside from the stretchy leggings look they got, another thing that I hate about it is that with wear, its finish begins to flake, leaving an exposed gray, matte surface.

If money isn't too big of an issue, try these...

https://www.ssense.com/en-hr/men/product/rick-owens/black-tyrone-leather-pants/11733521

I've handled them in Vienna, very, very nice pair of leather trousers and that's coming from someone who strongly dislikes Rick Owens. Leather is good, thin but strong & of high quality. Slim fitting. Etc.

rick-owens-black-tyrone-leather-pants.jpg
 

Bfd70

I'll Lock Up
Messages
4,008
Location
Traverse city
Op i think you’ve come to the wrong place with the question. Those pants are just not the style that is commonly discussed here. The advice you are likely to trend towards heavier weight motorcycle pants. If you like the picture you listed you are in the market for a current fashion trend.
 

Lorinz

Familiar Face
Messages
52
While this depends entirely on your lifestyle of course - In example, on the nature and the extent of wear you will subject your pants to - I do believe you'd regardless want your very expensive pair of leather pants to be as durable as possible since repairs aren't really an option. So yep, lambskin is simply too delicate for a pair of pants. It rips extremely easily, sometimes even from no external factors. Even the thinnest cotton fabric is incomparably tougher than lamb.

It also barely even looks like leather per se. I still more often than not, can't tell it apart from some synthetic faux leather material.

And aside from the stretchy leggings look they got, another thing that I hate about it is that with wear, its finish begins to flake, leaving an exposed gray, matte surface.

If money isn't too big of an issue, try these...

https://www.ssense.com/en-hr/men/product/rick-owens/black-tyrone-leather-pants/11733521

I've handled them in Vienna, very, very nice pair of leather trousers and that's coming from someone who strongly dislikes Rick Owens. Leather is good, thin but strong & of high quality. Slim fitting. Etc.

rick-owens-black-tyrone-leather-pants.jpg

Thank you for the detailed post. Sadly those rick owens pants don't have my size. I was looking around on Vanson's site, and saw this pair here:

WOODSTOCK JEANS

You're very knowledgeable about this topic so I was wondering, do you know anything about that Firenze style of leather and the general quality and sturdiness of it, since that leather according to the description they give is more soft and supple? Another thing is, I love leather and the aesthetic of that kind of clothing, but one thing I worried about is the possibility of it looking poserish, since I am not a biker and just like this stuff as a fashion thing. Do you feel that woodstock style of pants I linked is fashionable looking enough that it would help to avoid that "poser" element and not look too much like full on biker gear pants?
 

Edward

Bartender
Messages
24,701
Location
London, UK
Op i think you’ve come to the wrong place with the question. Those pants are just not the style that is commonly discussed here. The advice you are likely to trend towards heavier weight motorcycle pants. If you like the picture you listed you are in the market for a current fashion trend.


Styleforum might be a more natural home for this sort of thing?
 

Aloysius

My Mail is Forwarded Here
Messages
3,173
Thank you for the detailed post. Sadly those rick owens pants don't have my size. I was looking around on Vanson's site, and saw this pair here:

WOODSTOCK JEANS

You're very knowledgeable about this topic so I was wondering, do you know anything about that Firenze style of leather and the general quality and sturdiness of it, since that leather according to the description they give is more soft and supple? Another thing is, I love leather and the aesthetic of that kind of clothing, but one thing I worried about is the possibility of it looking poserish, since I am not a biker and just like this stuff as a fashion thing. Do you feel that woodstock style of pants I linked is fashionable looking enough that it would help to avoid that "poser" element and not look too much like full on biker gear pants?

I thought the other pair (the Traveler) would be more your style, given the Woodstock are boot cuts with a slight bell bottom.

As for the leather, both are good. The Firenze is a thinner and thus perhaps drapier than the comp weight, however the comp weight is plenty supple and soft itself so I wouldn't be put off by it. I tried both out at the Vanson factory this year.
 
Messages
16,351
This is as good a place as Style-forum to ask for an advice about leather trousers as we are very knowledgeable about leather, fit and jeans, which is what the OP needs assistance with. Besides, many aspects of the Golden era style is currently more in fashion than generic leather jeans.

Thank you for the detailed post. Sadly those rick owens pants don't have my size. I was looking around on Vanson's site, and saw this pair here:

WOODSTOCK JEANS

You're very knowledgeable about this topic so I was wondering, do you know anything about that Firenze style of leather and the general quality and sturdiness of it, since that leather according to the description they give is more soft and supple? Another thing is, I love leather and the aesthetic of that kind of clothing, but one thing I worried about is the possibility of it looking poserish, since I am not a biker and just like this stuff as a fashion thing. Do you feel that woodstock style of pants I linked is fashionable looking enough that it would help to avoid that "poser" element and not look too much like full on biker gear pants?

@Aloysius answered your question on Firenze leather so other than agreeing, I've nothing to add and as for the poserih part - Leather jeans are just that; Jeans made out of leather. You can certainly wear them on a motorcycle but they certainly don't belong to bikers, never have and if anything, they're much more related to music, pure fashion & last but not least, fetishism, so you've nothing to worry about.

Vanson's Woodstock jeans are just a regular boot-cut styled jeans and aren't any more or less fashionable than the Monfrere jeans that you've posted - But! - They might not fit you as slim as you'd like if slim is what you're after. The Traveler is a better call but neither these are very slim fitting. That's the only issue with motorcycle-intended leather jeans; They're all loose(ish) which is why I recommended having them tailored for an ideal, perfect fit.

But I recalled of something! I've handled these some time ago, they're literally exactly the same style & cut as Monfrere, also made in lambskin, except of much higher quality as they're constructed out of two layers of hide fused together!
https://www.bockleder.de/community/produkt_v22.php?id=868
They got give, are very slim fitting and are of course, much, much more affordable than the ones you posted.
Here's the cowhide version (It's not the mega-heavy cowhide like Vanson but 0.9mm kind that's more wearable than most heavy cotton jeans)...
https://www.bockleder.de/community/produkt_v22.php?id=217

This maker is obviously a bit more fetish fashion oriented but whatever, it's just a pair of pants. Half of leather pants are by fetish makers and are some of the best built leather garments I've handled.

Check out the leather on these!!

369c414d-f7fc-4736-9aea-30a0dafc7732

53c9c6bb-17b3-440f-acb6-21138f696b38
 

Lorinz

Familiar Face
Messages
52
This is as good a place as Style-forum to ask for an advice about leather trousers as we are very knowledgeable about leather, fit and jeans, which is what the OP needs assistance with. Besides, many aspects of the Golden era style is currently more in fashion than generic leather jeans.



@Aloysius answered your question on Firenze leather so other than agreeing, I've nothing to add and as for the poserih part - Leather jeans are just that; Jeans made out of leather. You can certainly wear them on a motorcycle but they certainly don't belong to bikers, never have and if anything, they're much more related to music, pure fashion & last but not least, fetishism, so you've nothing to worry about.

Vanson's Woodstock jeans are just a regular boot-cut styled jeans and aren't any more or less fashionable than the Monfrere jeans that you've posted - But! - They might not fit you as slim as you'd like if slim is what you're after. The Traveler is a better call but neither these are very slim fitting. That's the only issue with motorcycle-intended leather jeans; They're all loose(ish) which is why I recommended having them tailored for an ideal, perfect fit.

But I recalled of something! I've handled these some time ago, they're literally exactly the same style & cut as Monfrere, also made in lambskin, except of much higher quality as they're constructed out of two layers of hide fused together!
https://www.bockleder.de/community/produkt_v22.php?id=868
They got give, are very slim fitting and are of course, much, much more affordable than the ones you posted.
Here's the cowhide version (It's not the mega-heavy cowhide like Vanson but 0.9mm kind that's more wearable than most heavy cotton jeans)...
https://www.bockleder.de/community/produkt_v22.php?id=217

This maker is obviously a bit more fetish fashion oriented but whatever, it's just a pair of pants. Half of leather pants are by fetish makers and are some of the best built leather garments I've handled.

Check out the leather on these!!

369c414d-f7fc-4736-9aea-30a0dafc7732

53c9c6bb-17b3-440f-acb6-21138f696b38


Thanks a lot for that detailed post, appreciate it. I have to ask, looking at that site I noticed the pants being in the range of say $200 US; why are they so inexpensive? I always heard that generally good quality leather pants are pretty much gonna run over $500, yet these are so cheaply priced by comparison. Is there a reason for this? Because I generally assumed below say the $500 price point, the quality of the leather used would have to be cheap and poor quality. I'm really curious how this site and similar places are able to sell this stuff so cheap.
 

Aloysius

My Mail is Forwarded Here
Messages
3,173
Thanks a lot for that detailed post, appreciate it. I have to ask, looking at that site I noticed the pants being in the range of say $200 US; why are they so inexpensive? I always heard that generally good quality leather pants are pretty much gonna run over $500, yet these are so cheaply priced by comparison. Is there a reason for this? Because I generally assumed below say the $500 price point, the quality of the leather used would have to be cheap and poor quality. I'm really curious how this site and similar places are able to sell this stuff so cheap.

There are two factors. Lambskin, because it's so thin, can be sewn on a normal sewing machine like a fabric, so that's one big savings in capital and labor.

And then Vanson goes above and beyond simply machining their leather into jeans; because they are a motorcycle safety equipment company, all of those things are extra reinforced.

And if the German ones are made overseas (which isn't inherently a bad thing, if you have quality control), that's an additional savings.
 

navetsea

I'll Lock Up
Messages
6,697
Location
East Java
overseas labor cost, the world don't all run in euro or dollar, big chunk of the world are running on their own currency and if their currency is low compared to your currency everything they sell even on a decent profit would feel very cheap to you.
 
Messages
16,351
I have to ask, looking at that site I noticed the pants being in the range of say $200 US; why are they so inexpensive?

They're not inexpensive at all - $200 is a ceiling that any maker that isn't a luxury fashion brand, ought be asking for a pair of leather pants. Especially leather lambskin pants. Bockle is still having a considerable profit margin at that price.

I always heard that generally good quality leather pants are pretty much gonna run over $500...

People who don't have a clue will often parrot stuff like that, mostly so to justify the amounts of money they've spent on overpriced purchases but no, that couldn't be more divorced from truth. There's an entire thread here on TFL dedicated to costs associated with making or selling leather garments.

Is there a reason for this? Because I generally assumed below say the $500 price point, the quality of the leather used would have to be cheap and poor quality.

Also false. There are, of course, quality levels but at $200 a pair, you are safe to expect quality to be high. Finest, most expensive leather will of course ramp up a price but not nearly as much as that little square nylon tag with a brand name.

Look at it this way - Check out these leather jeans:
https://www.fc-moto.de/epages/fcm.s...SubProducts/Modeka-Ryley-Leather-Trouser-0007
These pants are made by Modeka, a reasonably well known motorcycle leather apparel maker. These guys don't & can't mess around, their gear has to be up to a certain standard so these simply can't be shit and yet somehow, their 1.2 mm leather jeans (with no mid-leg / knee seam) cost "only" 160 Euros. And they still make a good profit off those. So you can see how much money actually goes into making of leather jeans. . .

I've had these, by the way. Legit 10/10 pair.

Then there is Halvarssons, Swedish based, premium, top-grade, professional biker gear maker with one of my favorite products of theirs...
https://www.fc-moto.de/epages/fcm.s...Products/Halvarssons-Rider-Moto-Lthr-Pnt-0009
These pants are among the best money can buy! Armoured; CE certified; Anatomically shaped; Loads of features & unique design; Made entirely in beautiful Goatskin, which is arguably the best leather motorcycle apparel can be made of (and also the priciest)... Yet, these trousers still don't cost $500.

So yeah, for $200, it is safe to say you're getting a damn good pair of pants.

$500, however, for a lambskin pair of jeans... Quality is the last thing your money is buying.
 

Lorinz

Familiar Face
Messages
52
They're not inexpensive at all - $200 is a ceiling that any maker that isn't a luxury fashion brand, ought be asking for a pair of leather pants. Especially leather lambskin pants. Bockle is still having a considerable profit margin at that price.



People who don't have a clue will often parrot stuff like that, mostly so to justify the amounts of money they've spent on overpriced purchases but no, that couldn't be more divorced from truth. There's an entire thread here on TFL dedicated to costs associated with making or selling leather garments.



Also false. There are, of course, quality levels but at $200 a pair, you are safe to expect quality to be high. Finest, most expensive leather will of course ramp up a price but not nearly as much as that little square nylon tag with a brand name.

Look at it this way - Check out these leather jeans:
https://www.fc-moto.de/epages/fcm.s...SubProducts/Modeka-Ryley-Leather-Trouser-0007
These pants are made by Modeka, a reasonably well known motorcycle leather apparel maker. These guys don't & can't mess around, their gear has to be up to a certain standard so these simply can't be shit and yet somehow, their 1.2 mm leather jeans (with no mid-leg / knee seam) cost "only" 160 Euros. And they still make a good profit off those. So you can see how much money actually goes into making of leather jeans. . .

I've had these, by the way. Legit 10/10 pair.

Then there is Halvarssons, Swedish based, premium, top-grade, professional biker gear maker with one of my favorite products of theirs...
https://www.fc-moto.de/epages/fcm.s...Products/Halvarssons-Rider-Moto-Lthr-Pnt-0009
These pants are among the best money can buy! Armoured; CE certified; Anatomically shaped; Loads of features & unique design; Made entirely in beautiful Goatskin, which is arguably the best leather motorcycle apparel can be made of (and also the priciest)... Yet, these trousers still don't cost $500.

So yeah, for $200, it is safe to say you're getting a damn good pair of pants.

$500, however, for a lambskin pair of jeans... Quality is the last thing your money is buying.

Thanks, I really had no idea how the pricing worked for stuff like that, it's honestly nuts to see so many people online swearing good quality leather pants have to be real expensive, and seeing that's not even the case.

Btw, for Vanson and sizing for their leather pants, when calling them on the phone I was told they run different from other pants(jeans, dress pants, chinos, etc.) and so when sizing them you don't go by the size you wear for other pants. I was told to measure at the belt line using a tape measure. Watching a video their site linked, it mentioned at the bellybutton area, so would this be the most accurate way of measuring? Also is a simple tape measure fine, the video mentioned something about using an elastic band and stapling the tape measure to it, is that really necessary or can I just wrap the tape measure around my waist like I would when measuring for any other pants?

This is the video I'm referencing btw:

I'm asking this because I want to be sure, I figure the person on the phone knew what they were talking about(so I don't want to make any assumptions), but I've also had experience with calling clothing stores online and the people giving funny advice or not seeming to truly know what they were talking about and having to figure it out on my own or from other people. You have a lot of experience, so with Vanson would simply measuring around my beltline with the tape measure suffice? Would it be around the belly button pretty much?
 
Messages
16,351
@Lorinz - Vanson can be a bit odd like that, yeah. Though in my experience, their pants simply run one size smaller though that too might depend on the year of production, as well. I have no idea what they're right now.

But I'm afraid I know what the guy over at Vanson is talking about and it's something you might not like - The front rise. There's a belt-line and then there's a belt-line. Vanson might have raised the waist, possibly all the way up to your bellybutton and that's not a particularly good look. . .

Give them another call & ask them which model has a regular / mid rise - Though from what I'm reading online, you're in luck as the Woodstock might be it - And take it from there. You know your jeans size. Measure the waist of ones that fit you best & ask Vanson to tell you which size has the same waist width with similar rise.
 

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