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Messages
19,005
Location
Central California
Hi Bill, I wanted to post pics of the hat as I received it today. I hope this gives you a good indication of the uniqueness of it. The shape is as I received it. It's interesting for sure as it has a great snap brim. The backend of the ribbon is an unusual factory touch and the felt is identical to an early 1950s Open Road and it has a 3" brim as opposed to the Open Road at 2 3/4". Let me know what you think. View attachment 616237 View attachment 616238 View attachment 616239 View attachment 616240 View attachment 616241 View attachment 616242 View attachment 616243 View attachment 616244 View attachment 616246


Not 1957…I’d bet serious money it’s 1960s. That bow looks nothing like any “early 1950s Open Road” that I’ve seen.

It’s a cool style and one I’d wear a lot if it was in my size. Congrats on a nice less common hat.
 
Messages
19,005
Location
Central California
Hi Bill, I wanted to post pics of the hat as I received it today. I hope this gives you a good indication of the uniqueness of it. The shape is as I received it. It's interesting for sure as it has a great snap brim. The backend of the ribbon is an unusual factory touch and the felt is identical to an early 1950s Open Road and it has a 3" brim as opposed to the Open Road at 2 3/4". Let me know what you think. View attachment 616237 View attachment 616238 View attachment 616239 View attachment 616240 View attachment 616241 View attachment 616242 View attachment 616243 View attachment 616244 View attachment 616246


Here’s a hat, also early 1960s, with a similar ribbon and bow. As for the date, I’ve bought several hats where the family members are sure of the provenance and age of the hat and can show photos of grandpa wearing it in 1947 when he mustered of out the army. The hats often prove to be from the 1980s. I once had a man insist that his Dion Sanders’ Dobbs signature hat was from the 1920s and he wouldn’t hear anything about the conflict of facts such as Mr. Sanders’ silkscreened name on the liner of the “Dion” metal pin on the bow. Many people are well-Intentioned but are way off on dates no matter what “proof” they claim. I have a lot of hats pass through my hands and I’m still occasionally way off too so no judgements.


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Bill Hughes

My Mail is Forwarded Here
Messages
3,132
Location
North Texas
Hi Bill, I wanted to post pics of the hat as I received it today. I hope this gives you a good indication of the uniqueness of it. The shape is as I received it. It's interesting for sure as it has a great snap brim. The backend of the ribbon is an unusual factory touch and the felt is identical to an early 1950s Open Road and it has a 3" brim as opposed to the Open Road at 2 3/4". Let me know what you think. View attachment 616237 View attachment 616238 View attachment 616239 View attachment 616240 View attachment 616241 View attachment 616242 View attachment 616243 View attachment 616244 View attachment 616246
Overall I like it. I would say 60s but others may go with 50s.
 

AbbaDatDeHat

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,709
Hi Bill, I wanted to post pics of the hat as I received it today. I hope this gives you a good indication of the uniqueness of it. The shape is as I received it. It's interesting for sure as it has a great snap brim. The backend of the ribbon is an unusual factory touch and the felt is identical to an early 1950s Open Road and it has a 3" brim as opposed to the Open Road at 2 3/4". Let me know what you think. View attachment 616237 View attachment 616238 View attachment 616239 View attachment 616240 View attachment 616241 View attachment 616242 View attachment 616243 View attachment 616244 View attachment 616246
Yay you got it.
Cool looking proportions.
Maple leaf sweat and liner, black sweat screams 60’s.
Only 50’s indication is the keyhole size tag.
To bad no pics of inside factory labels.
Guess the story is to be continued.

Strikes me as a transitional 60’s hat due to the size tag.
Ribbon is unique.
I’m going with Ginger and the 60’s for a hundred Gilligan, but the Professor would know.
B
 

gilligan

One of the Regulars
Messages
173
Location
harrisburg, PA
Yay you got it.
Cool looking proportions.
Maple leaf sweat and liner, black sweat screams 60’s.
Only 50’s indication is the keyhole size tag.
To bad no pics of inside factory labels.
Guess the story is to be continued.

Strikes me as a transitional 60’s hat due to the size tag.
Ribbon is unique.
I’m going with Ginger and the 60’s for a hundred Gilligan, but the Professor would know.
B
Wow, thank you so much. I looked under the band but there wasn't a single label. And I agree with the transitional theory with the combination of the size tag style and sweat being black.
 

gilligan

One of the Regulars
Messages
173
Location
harrisburg, PA
Here’s a hat, also early 1960s, with a similar ribbon and bow. As for the date, I’ve bought several hats where the family members are sure of the provenance and age of the hat and can show photos of grandpa wearing it in 1947 when he mustered of out the army. The hats often prove to be from the 1980s. I once had a man insist that his Dion Sanders’ Dobbs signature hat was from the 1920s and he wouldn’t hear anything about the conflict of facts such as Mr. Sanders’ silkscreened name on the liner of the “Dion” metal pin on the bow. Many people are well-Intentioned but are way off on dates no matter what “proof” they claim. I have a lot of hats pass through my hands and I’m still occasionally way off too so no judgements.


View attachment 616318 View attachment 616319 View attachment 616320 View attachment 616321
Wow, very interesting and I really appreciate the advice. You're right, the ribbon and bow treatment are identical. Dating these hats can really be anyone's guess at times. I really appreciate the pics.
Overall I like it. I would say 60s but others may go with 50s.
Wow, thank you Bill.
 

gilligan

One of the Regulars
Messages
173
Location
harrisburg, PA
Ok, I'll play . . .

Royal Stetson. Hmmm. Doesn't look like a '50s sweatband to me.

What's under the sweatband? How is it sewn in? How is the liner attached?
Good questions. I looked under the sweat band and there aren't any labels at all and the liner is sewn in. The only #'s printed on the sweat are 570316.
 
Messages
10,539
Location
vancouver, canada
Hello all!

I have been thinking lately about the little crown pillow/cushion seen inside some montecristi and other straw hats.

Does anyone have any info on how these are made?


Edited to provide reference image:
I don't have any vintage Panama hats just custom/modern ones. The liners tips on mine are small and look to be a satin fabric with the edges folded over, not stitched but just the edges are glued to the straw. With just the folded over edge glued the balance of the fabric bulges out a bit and creates the puffy pillow effect. I have made a few hats from Panama blanks and replicated this look by doing exactly as I describe and it looks about the same.
 

Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,625
Location
Denmark
Wonderful, thought provoking images, Mark.

I think, though, perhaps you posted this in the wrong thread.

However, I'll ask the question: do we and our kids truly know how much we owe to these people, that generation, and their sacrifice for our future?

May they always be remembered.
 
Messages
19,257
Location
Funkytown, USA
Wonderful, thought provoking images, Mark.

I think, though, perhaps you posted this in the wrong thread.

However, I'll ask the question: do we and our kids truly know how much we owe to these people, that generation, and their sacrifice for our future?

May they always be remembered.

I hope so. I owe two of them a lot, being my parents and all.
 

Olumin

New in Town
Messages
24
Location
EU
Is it possible for a regular tailor to sew in a new sweatband? Are special skills or tools necessary a regular alterations tailor might not posses? I ask because I have two panamas I would like to equip with leather sweatbands. This means the old cloth band will have to be removed and replaced with a new leather one. Is this a simple job or something more complicated best left to hatters? Thanks.
 

jlee562

I'll Lock Up
Messages
5,072
Location
San Francisco, CA
Is it possible for a regular tailor to sew in a new sweatband? Are special skills or tools necessary a regular alterations tailor might not posses? I ask because I have two panamas I would like to equip with leather sweatbands. This means the old cloth band will have to be removed and replaced with a new leather one. Is this a simple job or something more complicated best left to hatters? Thanks.

Send it to a hatter.

A tailor might technically be able to do it, but if they are not practiced at it, the sweat band might not sit well inside the crown and/or the reed might not bell out as optimally. Also, cleanly joining the ends of the sweat is not a trivial task if one has never done it before.
 

RickP

One of the Regulars
Messages
280
Brim Stitching.... from anyones experience, does adding multiple rows of "decorative" stitching on the brim of a soft hat add any appreciable firmness to the brim? (soft fur felt or wool)
 

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